[pbiouk]

Hey guys,

I'm going to throw a spanner in the works (excuse the pun!).

We all know that the viewing glass to see the oil level on the Scrambler is a royal pain in the bum to use. A very slight lean of the bike to the left or right drastically affects the oil level in the viewing glass.

Gusan... could you please tell us what your setup is for looking at the viewing glass as it has to be spot on and exactly the same everytime?

Just as an idea.... maybe due to your setup of reading the viewing glass oil level, you think it doesn't have enough oil and so you fill it up. Due to the excess amount of oil and i pressume excess pressure (i don't know enough about engines), maybe the oil is then being burnt off?
After a few rides you check your oil again and due to not having a good setup up for checking the level, you presume that oil has been used up somewhere (again) and so you put more oil in (again)?

 

[Gusan]

Detecting an oily wet airbox is not that hard.

mentioned already, dry as a bone

 

[Max Kool]

Meaning you can rule out overfilling and/or blowing off oil through the case ventilation.

Do riding buddies even complain about your bike smoking?

 

[Gusan]

Hey guys,

I'm going to throw a spanner in the works (excuse the pun!).

We all know that the viewing glass to see the oil level on the Scrambler is a royal pain in the bum to use. A very slight lean of the bike to the left or right drastically affects the oil level in the viewing glass.

Gusan... could you please tell us what your setup is for looking at the viewing glass as it has to be spot on and exactly the same everytime?

Just as an idea.... maybe due to your setup of reading the viewing glass oil level, you think it doesn't have enough oil and so you fill it up. Due to the excess amount of oil and i pressume excess pressure (i don't know enough about engines), maybe the oil is then being burnt off?
After a few rides you check your oil again and due to not having a good setup up for checking the level, you presume that oil has been used up somewhere (again) and so you put more oil in (again)?

I see what you're getting at, and I don't have a scientific set up haha. But no, I don't think my set up is entirely the problem (but may contribute?) As I said earlier, my previous bike never needed any top ups, so I never thought to check the oil level on a regular basis. Only after some riding did I check and find there was NO OIL in the sight glass. It required almost a liter and a half to get it up to the full indicator. I think I'd need to have had the bike upsidedown to screw it up that much

 

[Gusan]

Meaning you can rule out overfilling and/or blowing off oil through the case ventilation.

Do riding buddies even complain about your bike smoking?

No, and video does not show me noticably smoking either. But I do think that I catch a whiff of something from time to time. I guess where I'm at now is. if I am burning oil (which I must be) what can I do about it?

 

[Max Kool]

Trade it for a new/different one, serious.

This is gonna cost a lot of headaches, not worth it.


Unlesssss, you are or know a good mechanic and like a nice project. Pull it apart, open it up, get the verniers out, replace the rings, get it honed. etc

 

[Hawkeye]

Only after some riding did I check and find there was NO OIL in the sight glass. It required almost a liter and a half to get it up to the full indicator. I think I'd need to have had the bike upsidedown to screw it up that much

When you were checking, was the bike on the sidestand?

Because there will often be no oil in the sight glass at all when the bike is on the sidestand. Then if you stand it upright the oil will slosh over and read a normal reading. If you're filling it up so the sight glass reads full while it's on the sidestand, you're overfilling it, which is then likely burning off.

When you did your oil changes, how much oil did you put in afterword? Did you put the reccomended amount according to the manual, or did you just add it until it looked full?

 

[Gusan]

Trade it for a new/different one, serious.

This is gonna cost a lot of headaches, not worth it.


Unlesssss, you are or know a good mechanic and like a nice project. Pull it apart, open it up, get the verniers out, replace the rings, get it honed. etc

Yeah that's the conclusion I'm coming to. Before I sink a lot more into this bike in terms of mods and upgrades, I might want to find a more sound machine. I think I just got unlucky

 

[Gusan]

When you were checking, was the bike on the sidestand?

Because there will often be no oil in the sight glass at all when the bike is on the sidestand. Then if you stand it upright the oil will slosh over and read a normal reading. If you're filling it up so the sight glass reads full while it's on the sidestand, you're overfilling it, which is then likely burning off.

When you did your oil changes, how much oil did you put in afterword? Did you put the reccomended amount according to the manual, or did you just add it until it looked full?

Yeah followed the manual to a T. Stood it upright as best as I could. If I could have tilted the bike into such a position that the oil level looked OK, I would have been satisfied and done with it. There is no such position where the bike is anywhere near upright and the oil level looks OK. No, I did not want to jam more oil in there than was required.

 

[pbiouk]

You need another person to help you for sure.
I had a go on my own and i thought it was 'fully upright' and so I panicked when the oil level was hardly showing. I asked the girlfriend to help so we both got the bike as upright as possible and then checked the level. It was still slightly low so we tilted it a tiny tiny bit one way and the oil level was correct.
Ducati should of put some sort of air bubble on the bike so that the correct upright position can be found.

 

[Max Kool]

I’m pretty sure Gusan knows how to check the oil level...

The fact that the airbox is dry proves to me he didn’t overfill.

 

[pbiouk]

As i said before, worth Gusan using another pair of hands and eyes.
Again, as I said before, I tried to check the oil level all by myself and with what i thought was upright, the bike wasn't and the oil level in the viewing glass wasn't even showing. To then lean the bike either way and keep my eyes on the viewing glass is very tricky to do.
For what it's worth, surely it's worth getting someone to stand the bike upright and do small adjustments to the lean angle whilst Gusan permanently watches the viewing glass. No harm.

 

[Gusan]

I heard a lot about using mineral oil for breaking in and I was always wondering why most of the manufactures don't use mineral oil for this purpose (at least I have never heard about it in Europe). Mostly you can find fully synthetic oil as a first one in engines and this was the case with my Scrambler too - I asked my Ducati dealer and I was told that Shall Advance 4T Ultra 15W50 oils goes as a first one.
Recently I picked up a brand new car and fully synthetic oil is used for breaking in too. And warranty the engine is 10 years!


I totally agree. I also mentioned about it at the first page of this topic and I think that Gusan should investigate this point the most, as it costs nothing to check and it can be very easy fix.

David glad to hear "it costs nothing to check and it can be very easy fix". That's the kind of check/fix I like. But I'm not sure what check and fix you mean?

 

[Gusan]

Gusan, if I were you, this is what I would do step by step:
1) Check if there are any leaks (check the front sprocket radial shaft seal too)
2) Check spark plugs for oil contamination
3) Check the air box for oil contamination
4) Check the crankcase ventilation system for any king of gunk, contamination
5) Perform dry compression test of two cylinders
6) Perform wet compression test of two cylinders if dry test goes bad
7) Perform leak-down test

First 6 point are relatively easy and cheap to do. No. 7 is more difficult, but you can easily do it on your own. If you check everything I suggested and perform all these test, you are 100% sure what is wrong with your engine.

Don't waste your money and don't buy different oil, nor endoscope. Hundreds of Scramblers were broken in on fully synthetic oil and I think you are the first one who has a problem with oil consumption.
About the endoscope - even if you find oil contamination on top of a piston, then what? You still don't know if it's cylinder head or bottom end - compression test might tell you that. If not compression test, then leak down test will do that.

Diagnose first and then start to act. Not the opposite.

Thanks for the helpful list. 1) - 3) are pretty straight forward and done. No leaks at all, but the upper spark plug looks fouled. Airbox looks good. But my knowledge of all this is pretty limited so not sure how do do 4) - 7) Any advice on how to do these things or a good place to read/learn about doing these procedures?

 

[dawid]

Thanks for the helpful list. 1) - 3) are pretty straight forward and done. No leaks at all, but the upper spark plug looks fouled. Airbox looks good. But my knowledge of all this is pretty limited so not sure how do do 4) - 7) Any advice on how to do these things or a good place to read/learn about doing these procedures?

Before performing any test from the list, I would suggest to check valve steam seals, as Bob described (despite it's quite straight forward, read about this method more in the Internet, just to be sure you know what you are doing). If it turns out that your valve steam seals don't seal any more, there is no point to perform any test from the list. Check the valve steam seals first and come back to us with your observations.

 

[ryanr256]

Before performing any test from the list, I would suggest to check valve steam seals, as Bob described (despite it's quite straight forward, read about this method more in the Internet, just to be sure you know what you are doing). If it turns out that your valve steam seals don't seal any more, there is no point to perform any test from the list. Check the valve steam seals first and come back to us with your observations.

I will add that since the vertical cylinder plug looks worse, and no one notices smoke while riding, my first check would be the valve seals.

I am by no means an expert though.

-Bob

 

[jazzndre]

My FT started to consume oil after 30kkm. That's the second Scrambler I know that has the same problem after approx the same mileage. In both cases the rings were to blame.

 

[Max Kool]

My BMW Xchallenge started consuming oil after 15000km's. As above, this was due to the rings.

But actually, the airfilter was more to blame than the rings. It just didn't keep all the dust out (lots of sand and dusty rides on that bike), despite repeatedly replacing it.

 

[chesterburnet]

You mentioned doing the clutch twice. I'd top off the oil, put in a new set of plugs and stop riding it and put a for sale sign on it. Some vehicles are just snake bit and will never be right. Yours sounds pretty close to that. Sorry.

 

[Hui]

That's one of the reasons bike dealers are going out of business. Twats trading in bikes with hidden problems and then a new owner claiming warranty under consumer laws. Destroying the dealers reputation in the process.
Exactly what's just happened to Gusan, not something I could do to someone. Take it on the chin and get it fixed.